Like their disparate fellow electronic pioneers Kraftwerk and Suicide, Sheffield's wonderful CABARET VOLTAIRE were way ahead of their time. Mute Records' extensive re-issue programme has ensured their essential legacy can again be accessed, and the new "Methodology: 1974-78" 3CD set is an unmissable archival trawl that demonstrates just how far out on a limb the Cabs were when they emerged to terrorise the Prog'n'flares-obsessed hordes back in the day. Whisperin' & Hollerin' are proud as punch to revisit the band's early days with none other than the Cabs' very own RICHARD.H.KIRK.
Richard, electronica is accepted as an essential part of the firmament these days with labels like Warp established as a (nicely subversive) commercial force, but I imagine when Cabaret Voltaire started in '73/'74 the equipment you used was very primitive by comparison?
"Oh God, yeah," says the affable Richard.
"Originally it was just a tape recorder and bits of percussion. Chris (Watson) sent off for a kit for a synth from an Electronics magazine. It was fairly decent actually, so that was a way forward. After that we gradually added stuff, like I got a clarinet and electrified it up, then a guitar and Mal (Stephen Mallinder) got a bass..."
So it was all very organic, then?
"Yeah, totally," says Richard.
"I mean, money was tight. Chris was the only one who could actually afford anything towards the equipment. I was still in school when we started and Mal was in college, so it was a case of be inventive with whatever gear we had. I remember a bit later we got an EMS synth, which was cutting edge, technology-wise at the time. Eno and Pink Floyd had used them. That was a big thing."
Did any of you actually play in rock'n'roll bands previously? Or was it a case of feeling total hatred towards everything everyone else was doing?
"No, none of us were interested in rock'n'roll," says Richard emphatically.
"We were a reaction to the likes of Yes, Genesis and their ilk and also all the naff pub rock stuff, but you must remember that decent electronic music was also virtually non-existent at the time. I mean, Punk hadn't started then."
"In retrospect, I guess a few other things had happened though," he continues.
"For instance, Dub was a big thing. I lived in a very multi-racial area of Sheffield and the young working class kids liked it. Hearing Keith Hudson's "Pick A Dub" album on Peel for the first time was a revelation in '75 (also this writer's fave dub LP - Ed) and dub reggae got to be a very big thing with us."
Absolutely, as anyone who hears great early CV singles like "Silent Command" and "Seconds Too Late" will be able to see. But Richard, what happened when the fledgling Cabs took this unholy noise out live for the first time in, what, 1975? Did the audiences "get" it?
"Er, no," says Richard, quietly suppressing a laugh.
"It was quite violent actually. I remember the first gig was I think when we did 2 sets at a dance at the local university. Chris knew the promoters and said we played rock to blag us onto the bill. A total con of course!"
He laughs and continues:
"We made this mad, crude noise and all sorts of mayhem kicked off. There was a stage invasion. In fact, even a bit later when we played the Lyceum in London with The Buzzcocks in 1977 we got spat on. It was only in about 1978 that audiences' minds started opening a bit. Prog and all that might have gone, but if you still weren't obviously punk you couldn't get a gig either..."
So the advent of Punk wasn't such a positive thing for Cabaret Voltaire then?
"Well, yes and no," Richard considers.
"It was good in that it helped opening doors in terms of finding venues and also that it made it clear that you didn't have to be competent musically to do something interesting. Those things were valuable."
Right. Of course the Cabs work has always had that sense of creeping paranoia about it, both in terms of the music's murky atmosphere and the radical content, in terms of you writing things like "Baader Meinhof" and "Do The Mussolini." How much did current events influence your direction?
"A lot, really," says Richard without hesitation.
"We did always try to reflect what was going on, not least in the news and radio broadcasts, which of course we brought in. It's true that there was a deliberate attempt to sound as disturbing as possible. I mean politically Sheffield was traditionally always a big Socialist stronghold, though that's probably changed now. That influenced our thinking as well as you could generally say we all leaned towards the left."
Cabaret Voltaire did harness the energy of Punk with their classic 1979 single "Nag Nag Nag", which has recently been remixed by Richard for re-release on 12". It's a really catchy song in an abrasive, subversive kinda way, but did you think it was a landmark record when you made it?
"No, to be honest we soon got bored with it," says Richard, matter-of-factly.
"It was great for its' time," he says, far too modestly.
"It came out of us doing our cover of The Seeds' "No Escape" (from the Cabs' debut album "The Mix-Up" and also featured in early form on "Methodology"- Ed) and it is still a great track in its' own way. We didn't really want it to be a milestone, though, because people started wanting more of the same which can soon stifle your creativity."
Yes, that's entirely understandable. Just to return to your point, though, you cut an excellent version of The Seeds' "No Escape" and also recorded a version of The Velvets' "Here She Comes Now" that could teach Lou Reed and co a thing or two about sounding strung out. Were you fans of the US garage rock explosion, or was this purely another method of subversion?
"No, we were serious about the Velvets," replies Richard.
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"I wouldn't say we based ourselves, but we did take on board part of that Warhol thing in terms of presentation and using visuals."
"Also, the stuff from "Nuggets" and those US underground compilations," he continues.
"Things like The Count Five's "Psychotic Reaction"...that's all there in "Nag Nag Nag". Rough Trade (CV label from 1978 - 1982) wanted us to do "Nag Nag Nag" in a proper 16-track studio rather than at the Western Works (legendary CV studio in Sheffield), which is why the single version's so beefy. Even so, our attitude in the studio was similar to many of the original garage bands...y'know, everything in one take and recorded totally live."
Technology-wise, was there a point in the Cabs where you felt you were making strides forward? For me, I think things like "Seconds Too Late" and the "Red Mecca" album from 1981 take some beating...
"Well, it all evolved gradually, like I was saying earlier," says Richard.
"Initially we were using an Akai 4000DS machine which ran 7inches per second. You could bounce overdubs onto it, but it was restricted to one mono track, but then we got hold of a Revox mastering machine, which was stereo."
"But things improved a lot when Rough Trade advanced us the money for a proper multitrack at the time of "Mix Up" (first CV album from 1978). We then advanced to using an 8-track for "Seconds Too Late" and "Red Mecca." We continued using that until we went to Some Bizarre and upgraded the Western Works to 16-track with Virgin's money."
Right. You also mentioned the visual aspect of the Cabs work. What was the first promo film you made? The one for "Nag Nag Nag"?
"No, way before that," says Richard.
"I was at art school in 1974/75 and back then I got a Super-8 camera from my Father and started making up slides. It was that combination of slides and Super 8 that we used live. The video for "Nag Nag Nag" actually came along much later - it wasn't made until 1982 actually."
Meanwhile, you went on to make fantastic promo films with (director) Peter Care, didn't you, such as "Yashar" (1982) and "Sensoria" (1984). Is he a creative bloke to work with?
"Yeah, he is. He was at the same art school as me," reveals Richard.
"He approached us to work with him, actually, when he was making the movie "Johnny Yes No" (subsequently soundtracked by the Cabs - Ed), and it was obvious we had certain ideas in common. "Yashar" was a great film and it's all the better for being made on a budget of about 30p. It was transferred over from Super8 and it still looks great on DVD!"
OK, well in terms of your own post-Cabs work, Richard, you've been making a name as a remixer. You feature as remixer (under the name Sweet Exorcist) on the track "Geezer" on the new ULTRAMARINE "Companion" remixes album. How did that come about?
"I didn't know about that album actually!" replies Richard, mildly surprised.
"I know the Ultramarine guys from way back, though. The same guy did press for them as the Cabs in the early '90s and they were fans of our stuff. They approached me formally to remix "Geezer" actually, and I did another track for them too, off the "United Kingdoms" album I think."
What current projects have you on the boil? Will there be more remixes of the Cabs singles after "Nag Nag Nag" and the recent "Yashar" 12"?
"I don't know for sure," says Richard.
"I'm busy with two albums of my own I have out. One's on a Montreal label called Coco. It's called "Bush Doctrine" and it's out under the name Biochemical Dread. The second one's supposedly as Richard.H.Kirk and it's called "TWAT"...that stands for "The War Against Terror", just in case you were wondering. It's a 49-minute sonic assault! I'm not entirely sure when that one'll see the light of day on general release, but I'm always working on stuff. It's important to carry on regardless," he finishes.
Very true. Finally, Richard, I read in the sleevenotes for the recent "Original Sound Of Sheffield" compilation that you said: "it's only the past few years the word 'innovators' has been used" in reference to Cabaret Voltaire. Did you really ever feel you were entirely ahead of your time musically when you were recording your early material?
"'I've really no idea," says Richard, sounding truly surprised.
"We were all too busy having a good time and we all lived very much in the present. I think in the early 1990s when Mute started re-issuing the early albums people started making noises about the work being influential and that's continued to this day."
"But do you know what?" he says, in conclusion...
"If I was given a fiver for everyone who's come up to me and said that they were influenced by the Cabs over the years, I'd be a very wealthy man indeed!"
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